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I have been searching the forums for an a few hours now and have not seen this lift mentioned before. It is a 2.5" front, 1.25" rear lift. It goes for $275. I have not seen anyone with this lift and this is also the highest one i can find besides the SMAXX. This one does include a 1.25" rear lift though. Has anyone used, heard or seen this lift before?


http://store.fatbobsgarage.com/shar...703345894&CategoryID=7371&Target=products.asp
 

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I have been searching the forums for an a few hours now and have not seen this lift mentioned before. It is a 2.5" front, 1.25" rear lift. It goes for $275. I have not seen anyone with this lift and this is also the highest one i can find besides the SMAXX. This one does include a 1.25" rear lift though. Has anyone used, heard or seen this lift before?


http://store.fatbobsgarage.com/shar...703345894&CategoryID=7371&Target=products.asp
If you follow the link and do a search for Trailblazer, it shows a picture of a lifted TB with this kit, but it doesn't show the kit itself. It also lists the BDS kit at $129, marked down from $149. Interesting that Mark's Lift Meister is, and always has been, $120. :thumbsup: Go with the Lift Meister. :hail: I did and I'm totally satisfied. :woohoo: The Lift Meister gives you 2.5" in the front & 2" in the rear. :woot: If you use the z71 springs, you will get another 2".
 

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It also lists the BDS kit at $129, marked down from $149.
Nope. The $129 kit is the Rough Country cheapie leveling kit. Looks more like BDS than anything else, but it isn't BDS. Its advantage is that they copied the BDS shock shaft mounting concept, with shock bushings in compression at the top of the spacer. Not like the rubber molded piece in the OEM upper mounts that can shear with overloading and aggressive offroading.

I would still buy BDS because they don't market it as a leveling kit (I have no use for leveling kits), if and only if you're going for maximum functionality. Rough Country's rear 3/4" spacers are ludicrous.

Confirm this by reading the Rough Country installation instructions:

http://roughcountry.com/install/289.pdf
 

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I would still buy BDS because they don't market it as a leveling kit (I have no use for leveling kits), if and only if you're going for maximum functionality. Rough Country's rear 3/4" spacers are ludicrous.
I understand the technical reasons that you prefer the BDS, and they are sound. However, to say that a kit is silly based simply on it being marketed as a "leveling" kit is ludicrous, itself.

The difference between a "lift" and a "leveling" kit is minor, and up for argument, anyway. My understanding is that a "lift" will maintain a rake similar to factory. Conversely, a "leveling" kit will bring the front to the same level as the rear, removing the rake. Generally the FRONT of a "leveling" kit is identical to what would be included in a comparable "lift" kit. The difference is in the rear.

Rough Country had some spacer kits for my old Tundra. The difference between their leveling and lift kits? Whether or not you got an AAL in the box :laugh:

So if someone wants the BDS-style front, but doesn't want BDS price... This isn't a terrible choice. Just put some bigger spacers in the rear, or maybe a Z71 spring.
 

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The term 'leveling' implies mall lift for visual purposes only. Us off roaders don't do it for the look, we do it as a means to go where we want.

I think Roadie was referring to the 3/4" spacer as ludicrous because of the amount of work it would be to install the spacer, for such a minimal amount of lift.
 

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The term 'leveling' implies mall lift for visual purposes only. Us off roaders don't do it for the look, we do it as a means to go where we want.
I have the MarkMC spacer, and I like it. I haven't had the opportunity to take it on any trails yet (need new shoes)... But I think it'll be fine for the casual weekend warrior.

Roadie has already explained why he prefers the BDS design. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this "leveling" kit actually employs that design. So if that is true, his distaste is merely at a marketing term.

By the way, some companies use the term "leveling kit" to describe any small lift.

I think Roadie was referring to the 3/4" spacer as ludicrous because of the amount of work it would be to install the spacer, for such a minimal amount of lift.
Yes, that is funny. But they do it so that it "levels" the vehicle. Without it, the vehicle would sit low in the rear (the way mine does, currently). I really need to stop being lazy and install my rear spacer :laugh:

But the point remains... You can use the front of that "leveling kit" with a Z71 rear spring or bigger spacer and it's basically a cheaper BDS kit, as far as I'm concerned.

Feel free to correct me. But please show me the physical difference in the front parts -- not some semantical argument over the magical marketing properties that the word "lift" posses that simply cannot be achieved with "leveling".
 

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Roadie has already explained why he prefers the BDS design. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this "leveling" kit actually employs that design. So if that is true, his distaste is merely at a marketing term.
That, and the implied disrespect that they don't offer a proper thickness rear spacer when they probably have that part already somewhere in their warehouse. And kits with no shocks to take advantage of increased rear articulation. I can be cranky at a vendor for a lot of trivial reasons, and Rough Country already annoys me for coming out with a kit AFTER the GM production line has quit producing new trailvoys. And five years after SuspensionMAXX came out with their first ever spacer kit. Late to the party with a kit that misses the mark for functional offroading. :weird:
But they do it so that it "levels" the vehicle.
I should run a search for a bit of automotive design history to see why the manufacturers are sticking us with these un-level vehicles in the first place. Do you know how this abomination came to be in the first place? Aerodynamics? Mileage? Artistic swoopiness? Why do they always have to look like they're going downhill?
The term 'leveling' implies mall lift for visual purposes only. Us off roaders don't do it for the look, we do it as a means to go where we want.
Yep. It's a code phrase to provide an artificial separation between us in the Offroad forum, and the "others" out there in the Suspension forum. We claim purity of purpose and the moral high ground. They keep their show poodle trucks clean.


Nobody's "better" of course. But it's a spoof we perpetuate more than we truly internalize, as a way to keep the inter-tribal competitive juices flowing. Throwing barbs and mocking the other camp is part of the culture here.
At least *I* try to keep it light, but I have taken it too far at times with the MORA crowd, I admit. :D

However, to say that a kit is silly based simply on it being marketed as a "leveling" kit is ludicrous, itself.
Reread what I said. I said I'd still buy BDS if and only if I was going for maximum functionality. Rough Country marketing folks had a chance to offer two kits. One with 3/4" rear spacers and the other with 2" or 2.5" spacers. They didn't. As somebody formerly in technical marketing, I used to do some careful analysis of product differentiation and customer benefits. By offering ONLY a leveling kit with thin rear spacers, Rough Country (IMHO) declared their intentions to be marketing a mall cruiser kit to folks concerned about appearance only. They could have easily come up with a second kit, and they didn't. I take that as a hint that they don't care about my use of the trailvoy platform. Of course, if lift companies ONLY sold to offroaders, the industry would shrivel up and die. They NEED the mall cruiser market. :rolleyes:
The difference between a "lift" and a "leveling" kit is minor, and up for argument, anyway. My understanding is that a "lift" will maintain a rake similar to factory. Conversely, a "leveling" kit will bring the front to the same level as the rear, removing the rake.
Hence my phrase about "maximum functionality." I've posted in the dim dark past why I want more ground clearance on the rear. We're so challenged anyway for height that every 1/2" helps. And most importantly, if I have to wedge a rock under the frame rail to slide along it (my scrapes show I need to do this a lot :eek: ) I want it to get LOOSER as I go forward. So rear lift needs to be higher if possible than the front.
So if someone wants the BDS-style front, but doesn't want BDS price... This isn't a terrible choice. Just put some bigger spacers in the rear, or maybe a Z71 spring.
It would have been nice if Rough Country thought enough about us to offer that kind of kit. To buy their cheap leveling kit and have to discard their 3/4" rear spacer still seems silly.
 

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I should run a search for a bit of automotive design history to see why the manufacturers are sticking us with these un-level vehicles in the first place. Do you know how this abomination came to be in the first place? Aerodynamics? Mileage? Artistic swoopiness? Why do they always have to look like they're going downhill?
I think there are several advantages for it.

First, a downward (forward) angle improves visibility over the hood. This is one of the reasons that GM put the front diff through the oil pan -- they could mount the engine lower and it let them put a more swooping hood and improve visibility (also lower center of gravity).

Secondly, when you put a lot of weight in the vehicle -- or if you connect a trailer, it's going to lower the rear ride height a few inches. A factory rake allows the vehicle to at least sit level (and not sit ass-low) when you've got that weight.

Lastly, it does look better that way, imo.


Reread what I said. I said I'd still buy BDS if and only if I was going for maximum functionality. Rough Country marketing folks had a chance to offer two kits. One with 3/4" rear spacers and the other with 2" or 2.5" spacers. They didn't.
Maybe something changed... But I did buy a Rough Country kit back in 2005... And they sold their front and rear parts separately. It was up to the customer (or retailer) to match them up for the desired effect. I checked their website and it does specify that the kit includes the 0.75" spacer. Too bad. It's still not the end of the world. Get Z71 springs!

As somebody formerly in technical marketing, I used to do some careful analysis of product differentiation and customer benefits. By offering ONLY a leveling kit with thin rear spacers, Rough Country (IMHO) declared their intentions to be marketing a mall cruiser kit to folks concerned about appearance only.
Say what you will, but that *IS* where the money is, for these vendors.

They could have easily come up with a second kit, and they didn't. I take that as a hint that they don't care about my use of the trailvoy platform.

...

I've posted in the dim dark past why I want more ground clearance on the rear. We're so challenged anyway for height that every 1/2" helps.
You're better off with Z71 springs than the spacers, anyway... So get those. This kit is fairly inexpensive.
Besides, the rear is not the problem on these trucks -- it's the front. Installing a spacers does NOT improve ground clearance on the rear, because it doesn't change the height of the pumpkin or axle tubes. You just need bigger tires for that -- and bigger tires don't really need a spacer, on the rear.

It would have been nice if Rough Country thought enough about us to offer that kind of kit. To buy their cheap leveling kit and have to discard their 3/4" rear spacer still seems silly.
Based on your posts, you have LESS REASON to complain about with this kit than you do the MarkMC kit. Why don't you insult him, then? Both MarkMC and RoughCountry put kits to market that fit the needs of their target audience. Both kits can be used outside of that target audience, to some extent. However, you may be very far away from their median -- why insult them for it?

It's ANOTHER option for the TV, and I applaud them simply for bringing CHOICE to the table. We need more manufacturers just to GIVE IT A CHANCE.
 

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Rough country:


BDS:

I don't think there's a question between the quality of the two kits. The BDS kit has much more thought put into long term durability.

P07r####, it seems your main quarrel is that you feel we shouldn't have a problem with a lesser quality kit, however that is exactly our frustration. We like BDS because it offers the greatest durability out of our options. For those of us that actually off road these things, thats what matters.

It's annoying to see copies of items already on the market. While it does drive cost down, it doesn't help us functionally. We are looking for a company to up the ante, if you will. We demand higher quality and greater functionality... not copies.
 

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First, a downward (forward) angle improves visibility over the hood...A factory rake allows the vehicle to at least sit level (and not sit ass-low) when you've got that weight...Lastly, it does look better that way, imo.
2 out of 3 excellent points.
Get Z71 springs!
Ummmm, I'm sort of the reason people ARE getting Z71 springs. :tiphat http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=42449 AlekG put in Skyjacker C25R 2.5" Tahoe lift springs, which gave him an effective 4" lift on his TB. That gave me an idea. I found a set of Tahoe Z71 takeoffs locally and tried fitting them as an experiment. Only 2007+ will fit. Then I discovered a thriving Ebay market in low mileage Z71 springs and shocks being taken off Tahoes and Avalanches, either for lowering, or for higher lifting, and posted about it. I run with BDS spacers, Z71 springs, AND Airlift1000 bags inside. I don't know of anybody else with Z71 springs and Airlift bags. My cup is overflowing with rear lift. :D
Say what you will, but that *IS* where the money is, for these vendors.
Understood. I mentioned that.
You're better off with Z71 springs than the spacers, anyway... So get those. This kit is fairly inexpensive.
My set only cost me $20. You should look at my profile and posting history before guessing I don't already have things. I had SuspensionMAXX the first month they came out with their spacer. And BDS the first WEEK they started shipping theirs. I didn't get to this many posts by hanging out in the chat threads. I was an early adopter and experimenter, and posted reports about ALL these things.
Besides, the rear is not the problem on these trucks -- it's the front. Installing a spacers does NOT improve ground clearance on the rear, because it doesn't change the height of the pumpkin or axle tubes.
I already know how to drive a line to keep the pumpkin out of the rocks. And the tires are probably ON the rocks. But rear lift does keep the frame rail higher off the ground, and the sensitive gas tank, muffler, cat, and so forth. I've resisted a BODY lift all this time because I haven't seen the need with 31-32" tires. When I go bigger my next generation, the body lift looks critical to get more wheel well clearance.
Based on your posts, you have LESS REASON to complain about with this kit than you do the MarkMC kit. Why don't you insult him, then?
Um, because Mark's a fellow member and friend? And he will sell his front spacers without his (full height) rears, but advises his users to get Z71 springs so they're level and well-functional. Just because a lot of his clientele spend a lot of time at the mall is no reason to insult Mark. Sheesh.
It's ANOTHER option for the TV, and I applaud them simply for bringing CHOICE to the table. We need more manufacturers just to GIVE IT A CHANCE.
Yeah, yeah. Like I didn't spend a bunch of my time 3-5 years ago haunting the offroad shows and talking to engineers at Procomp and Daystar and Tuff Country and Superlift and Skyjacker and Fabtech, etc., etc. Trying to get them interested in our platform and showing them pictures of where I wheeled. And these fine companies couldn't even cough up a leveling kit, let alone a real lift. And I spent weeks with three different fabricators trying to get a differential relocation kind of lift kit on the market with extended steering knuckles and I almost invested $4K in the tooling and CAD time for that to help everybody out. And I spend a week or so trying to convince an Ebay amateur fabricator that what he was selling was life-threatening and dangerous (a 3" OUTSIDE the strut spacer that would do a LOT of damage at full extension - this goofball had never considered the upper ball joint and CV issues at full extension!) and now you don't see that idiot on Ebay any more, thank goodness.

I'm not saying Rough Country is a bad outfit and I agree choice is always good.

But I continue to laugh at their 3/4" rear spacers. Sorry. Why even bother with something so thin? Even SuspensionMAXX rears start at 1.0"
 

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It's annoying to see copies of items already on the market. While it does drive cost down, it doesn't help us functionally. We are looking for a company to up the ante, if you will. We demand higher quality and greater functionality... not copies.
I've thought about that, before.... But short of a SAS or portal axles, you won't get more than 2-3" out of the front of our vehicles.

And there's "nothing new" about a SAS... People have done them on nearly every vehicle ever built... But they cost $$$. In fact, it's so cost-prohibitive, that the few people that could afford just the parts are not enough to make the R&D on assembling a kit worth-while. Furthermore, of the people that COULD afford the kit, very few of them would be willing to pay someone else to assemble the kit because they probably would want to choose their own parts/method, anyway. :duh:

So if a business has to remain profitable, and nothing beyond a 2-3" kit is profitable for our vehicles, you're mad at a business for trying to stay a business?

Sense. You make none.

At this point, in terms of a small lift kit (2-3"), we have already accomplished, technically, what is possible. So We should be GLAD that competition is going to drive the prices down. No one is saying that YOU have to give up your BDS kit... But let others take advantage of the price savings.

If you're going to "demand higher quality and greater functionality" then at least pick a category where we haven't "been there, done that". May I suggest proper bumpers (ARB?) or fender flares?
 

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:weird:I should run a search for a bit of automotive design history to see why the manufacturers are sticking us with these un-level vehicles in the first place. Do you know how this abomination came to be in the first place? Aerodynamics? Mileage? Artistic swoopiness? Why do they always have to look like they're going downhill?
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I found out it's to save the insurance companies money! When we drill someone in the a** in their p.o.s. car, we hit bumber to bumber instead of through their trunk. F*** 'em, I'm getting the lift and leveling mine out!
 

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If you follow the link and do a search for Trailblazer, it shows a picture of a lifted TB with this kit, but it doesn't show the kit itself. It also lists the BDS kit at $129, marked down from $149. Interesting that Mark's Lift Meister is, and always has been, $120. :thumbsup: Go with the Lift Meister. :hail: I did and I'm totally satisfied. :woohoo: The Lift Meister gives you 2.5" in the front & 2" in the rear. :woot: If you use the z71 springs, you will get another 2".


i would like to purchase this kit. sorry im new here ..... how do i get ahold of mark..? i am very seriouse about my tb and turning it into a mudder since all we have is mud wholes where im from. they way evryone describes this kit, it sounds like it for me.. hopefully someone can help me here thnks.
 
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